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Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Brian thanks for the compliment I am funny, but I not quite as funny as you. You seem like a nice guy, but you also seem to talk in circles never supporting your claims. You always seem to avoid the issue and jump into another issue, like answering a question with a question lol. Anyways I will not be wasting my time commenting on some of your "funny" topics that you bring up from time to time. Have a good one!

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Battling McLellan
I dont know if u have fought pro but i dont even consider amateur and pro the same sport. Pro is about hurtin the other guy as well as outsmarting him and amateur is about points one guy gets ahead and runs the rest of the fight. Amateur to me was like sparring for the pros i never wanted to be an amateur the only reason i fought in it was cuz i cant fight pro as a kid. It helped me tremendously but i was a victim of politics in the amateur system just cuz people dont want to hear it doesnt mean it didnt happen. As for taking a jab at my attidude i speak the real no matter who im talking to or what im talkin about and im a respectfull person. Im gonna make a great pro champion after September 10


you obvious must have had difficult times in amateur boxing if you think it is all about point scoring and running. Not sure when you fought as an amateur, but you obviously do not have much of understanding or appreciation concerning the history of the sport.

Just a random sample, take the finals of the 1954 BX GOLDRN GLOVES, one of the bouts two of the most efficient knockout artists JIMMY WALTERS and Bill (Curly) ADAMS. There were six knockdowns and it ended in a third round knockout.
Fast forward to 1967, it a bout that resulted in a one punch knockout, WESLEY CRAVEN starched JACK MEDA of Prince George with a short right hand and he fell like a large Spruce tree hitting the ground. Or fast forward to 1975,
and boxer GORDIE LAWSON scored the only clean knockout when his opponent was on the deck for over a minute.

Sorry to see you look at the sport in black and white, put your personal experiences aside, and look at some of the positive. But, your welcome to use
a tired old paint brush in your paint job of amateur boxing.

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Brian Zelley
Battling McLellan
I dont know if u have fought pro but i dont even consider amateur and pro the same sport. Pro is about hurtin the other guy as well as outsmarting him and amateur is about points one guy gets ahead and runs the rest of the fight. Amateur to me was like sparring for the pros i never wanted to be an amateur the only reason i fought in it was cuz i cant fight pro as a kid. It helped me tremendously but i was a victim of politics in the amateur system just cuz people dont want to hear it doesnt mean it didnt happen. As for taking a jab at my attidude i speak the real no matter who im talking to or what im talkin about and im a respectfull person. Im gonna make a great pro champion after September 10


you obvious must have had difficult times in amateur boxing if you think it is all about point scoring and running. Not sure when you fought as an amateur, but you obviously do not have much of understanding or appreciation concerning the history of the sport.

Just a random sample, take the finals of the 1954 BX GOLDRN GLOVES, one of the bouts two of the most efficient knockout artists JIMMY WALTERS and Bill (Curly) ADAMS. There were six knockdowns and it ended in a third round knockout.
Fast forward to 1967, it a bout that resulted in a one punch knockout, WESLEY CRAVEN starched JACK MEDA of Prince George with a short right hand and he fell like a large Spruce tree hitting the ground. Or fast forward to 1975,
and boxer GORDIE LAWSON scored the only clean knockout when his opponent was on the deck for over a minute.

Sorry to see you look at the sport in black and white, put your personal experiences aside, and look at some of the positive. But, your welcome to use
a tired old paint brush in your paint job of amateur boxing.

Got news for u its not 40 years ago and try speaking plain english itll make more sense u definatelly sound like someone involved in amateur boxing speaking in riddles. Listen to punchy and pull u head out does bc even have a amateur boxing organization at the moment?

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

THE WILLIAMS LAKE BOXING STORY
Round 1 - The Introduction
Without a solid foundation there can be no executive suite in the penthouse of boxing. The Williams Lake boxing journey begins with a look back at January 1984. Of interest one of the young boxers was named RICK ALBRECHTSEN. Fast forward to the here and now and Rick is a fine coach and trainer but from 1984 to 2011 there have been and are many more players in the story including those involved in professional boxing such as Battling McLellan

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

The follow-up, well I have now done a piece on the Williams Lake Boxing and
made a reference to the McLellan family and the Albrechtsen faimily.


I thought it was funny how Battling described the difference between amateur and professional. From my experience, I would not agree on the description of amateur boxing. However, I fought in the Sixties and first few years of the Seventies, so some of my opponents were not there to score points. Take
RAY LAMPKIN in our first fight in the 1968 Tacoma Golden Gloves. When he feinted
a right hand and I weaved into his left hook that did not feel like simple point
scoring after it exploded against my head. Maybe the boxers of the Sixties were
tougher and more durable of the current amateur boxers. We may have moved
around the ring, but we did not run even if we got smashed in the head.

Also, when we fought in 1964, we had no headguards and we wore 8oz gloves.
So, I do not see that different than any beginning pro fight of four rounds. In fact
some of the dudes turning pro were not the toughest or the best boxers. some were catchers in the amateurs and were catchers or soft touches for the pros.

Now, take any hot shot pro from the Pacific Northwest in the Seventies or Eighties and look at their records and then look at the records of their opponents and see how many one-sided mismatches were made.

it is pretty easy to smear amateur boxing, but the crap that happens in amateur boxing in the past is mild compared to some of the nasty stuff that has been churned out it professional boxing.

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Brian you are F*cken delusional when you state "it is pretty easy to smear amateur boxing, but the crap that happens in amateur boxing in the past is mild compared to some of the nasty stuff that has been churned out it professional boxing." Either you do not know what you are talking about or have not paid attention. Does 1988 Olympic games bring back memories when most of the judges were paid off by the Koreans and Roy Jones getting robbed of a gold medal only to win Val Barkers award for the best boxer. Then the IOC specifically told AIBA to change their system of scoring do to all the corruption and now we have the computer scoring which is worst. In the pro game you know what you are getting into and ae aware of the unbalance variables. In amateur boxing they try to project an image being clean but behind the scenes are more corrupt than any sport in the world. I would suggest you do more research before you get on here and make blanket statements that are so untrue.
Also, look at the media amateur boxing got in the past. Next to track and field amateur boxing got the most television exposure at the Olympic games, until the corruption and and the scoring system got so bad that it was unbearable to watch. Look at past amateur boxers who were household names such as; Willie DeWitt, Shawn O'Sullivan, Lennox Lewis, and even Scotty Olson. Main steam media does not want anything to do with our sport due to the corruption and scoring system which the average person cannot understand. It is people like you who want to turn a blind eye to the problem instead of ackknowleging it and addressing it, that keeps the state of amateur boxing in the mess that it is in.

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Recent link on Article at 2011 World Amateur Championships:
"AIBA Begins Probe Into Gold Medal Corruption Claim"
http://www.boxingscene.com/aiba-begins-probe-into-gold-medal-corruption-claims--44662

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Punchy
Brian you are F*cken delusional when you state "it is pretty easy to smear amateur boxing, but the crap that happens in amateur boxing in the past is mild compared to some of the nasty stuff that has been churned out it professional boxing." Either you do not know what you are talking about or have not paid attention. Does 1988 Olympic games bring back memories when most of the judges were paid off by the Koreans and Roy Jones getting robbed of a gold medal only to win Val Barkers award for the best boxer. Then the IOC specifically told AIBA to change their system of scoring do to all the corruption and now we have the computer scoring which is worst. In the pro game you know what you are getting into and ae aware of the unbalance variables. In amateur boxing they try to project an image being clean but behind the scenes are more corrupt than any sport in the world. I would suggest you do more research before you get on here and make blanket statements that are so untrue.
Also, look at the media amateur boxing got in the past. Next to track and field amateur boxing got the most television exposure at the Olympic games, until the corruption and and the scoring system got so bad that it was unbearable to watch. Look at past amateur boxers who were household names such as; Willie DeWitt, Shawn O'Sullivan, Lennox Lewis, and even Scotty Olson. Main steam media does not want anything to do with our sport due to the corruption and scoring system which the average person cannot understand. It is people like you who want to turn a blind eye to the problem instead of ackknowleging it and addressing it, that keeps the state of amateur boxing in the mess that it is in.


PUNCHY, you're a funny guy. I have never turned a blind eye to problems in amateur and professional boxing. In fact, I have written about the problems of
amateur and professional boxing since at least the eighties and in some cases the seventies.

In the 1988 book "Island Of Champions", Cleve Dheesaw in the builders section wrote: "Brian Zelley, who in executive positions ...has championed the cause of
amateur boxing long and hard while decrying with passion the brutal excessers
of the pro game."

Anybody who read any of the issues of the "BC Amateur Boxing News: from
1983 to 1986 when I was the editor would have been aware of my position of some of the problems with amateur boxing. Nothing is new in 2011, the story is the same. So, please "Punchy" outline specific areas of the problems of amateur boxing and which eye is being turned blind. Maybe you and Battling
could get in a room and discuss all of the issues from matchmaking, team selections, bum decisions, rules and how some folks get nailed when they break them and others get a free pass. Problems in amateur boxing start at
the ground level in coaching and matchmaking. However, one thing that was not present in the Sixties was boxers did not duck out of fights or expect a free pass to some Championship, they did it the old fashioned way, they worked for it. However, team selection for a National or International event will always be
an area of controversy. Also, the selection of provincial team managers is subject to some back scratching from time to time.

To say amateur boxing is just about point scoring is not very bright. If we roll back the clock to the history of the BC GOLDEN GLOVES from 1939 to 1975, there any many knockouts that have been recorded and documented. Maybe, folks should look-up some of the history like the famous bout that featured
two knockout artists by the name of JIMMY WALTERS vs BILL "Curly" ADAMS,
or move the tape to 1967 when Seattle' WES CRAVEN knocked-out Prince George boxer JACK MEDA with a short right hand, or slip into the Seventies
when GORDIE LAWSON scored a knockout that had his opponent inert on the
deck for over a minute. Fast forward to the Eighties, and there were scores of knockouts.

Re: RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT, A QUESTION OF BALANCE

Punchy
Brian thanks for the compliment I am funny, but I not quite as funny as you. You seem like a nice guy, but you also seem to talk in circles never supporting your claims. You always seem to avoid the issue and jump into another issue, like answering a question with a question lol. Anyways I will not be wasting my time commenting on some of your "funny" topics that you bring up from time to time. Have a good one!


It isn't about supporting claims that is important, but sorting through the fact, fantasy and fiction. The title of this piece is RIGHTS, RESPONSIBILITY and RESPECT.

A broad topic to deal with amateur and professional boxing. So what are the RIGHTS: On the ground level, it is the right for all persons to compete on a level playing field. In reality, there is unlikely to be a level playing field due to special interests. Take pro boxing, and the tragic fight between EMILE GRIFFITH and BENNY KID PARET. It was a parade of non-rights, multi-level failure in responsibility, and even the fans got into the lack of respect routine.

The opening claim relates to the attitude that SOME pro boxers do not appreciate or respect amateur boxing in Canada. It was not for me to support that claim but that claim was quickly supported by the subsequent messages of Punchy, Battling and others.

An opening statement in a forum thread is not a MBA or PHD thesis that requires in-depth research and supporting reliable sources as references and quotes. At best it is like a lead jab or feint in the opening round of a boxing match, nothing more and nothing less.