I'm not racist!!!!!1 I was just comparing the two tournements. I feel like when black teams are playin the white tourneys they are treated like crap. Their is no type of bonding in this type opf setting.
also would like to let you know that we as black people are compassionate, accepting,forgiving.....When whites play on the Black circuit we make you guys feel comfortable; hell sometimes we go out of our way to make you guys comfortable.
To me if you really want to know is....We as a people should be the ones grabbing our purses in elevators or feel uncomfortable when a number of white men are together..... but we don't because we are once again forgiving people. We believe in God and the Bible.....we don't just read it and interpet it in a negative way. The biggest white so call chirstians had slaves.... and yet they went to church and read the bible constantly during the times of the rapes,beating,castrations,kidnappings,hangings etc......And I'm still not Racist but Aware!!!!!1

I am a "playa not of color" and look at this board almost daily. I don't know what caused this post but I will respond to yours. I spent several years playing BASA in STL and for a couple of years was the only white player at Fairgrounds on Monday nights, so obviously I am not racist either. I think the differnece between the tournaments is the smack talk that occurs during games. Most white teams don't like all the talk and let it get to them on the field. I don't think BASA teams are treated unfairly in other tournaments I just think most white teams would rather see them go home early so they don't have to listen to them all day. I don't say that in a negative way because as I said I have played BASA and enjoyed it. I am just speaking the truth as to what I see at other tournaments.

stl17 he is refering to your post on the subject "HIT THE ROAD".

STL player, I am going to have to correct you on the statement about white players not talking stuff. I play on the BASA circuit as well as with a white team. When my Black team plays in a white tournament, on weekends we dont have a scheduled tournament, it is one of the worse experiences. Going from playing on the BASA circuit to a "white" tournament is like culture shock. You speak of white teams dont talk stuff. Thats not "always" true. When we've played, if the white team is beating us, they feel as though they have accomplished something huge to be beating a black team, and then the mouths get to running. But it usually stops once we show them what a BASA team is about. I have much love for,you, STL17, and I have no problem with who plays on the circuit. Good luck to you and your team next year.

Let me first say I am NOT STL17. I don't want to be associate with what he said if it caused this stir.

I didn't mean to come across saying white teams never talk, some do and some do it a lot. It is two totally different games when you change circuits. Both circuits have great teams but the game is played much different and in a different atmosphere. You are correct that a white team will start to talk once they have a black team down or beaten. I don't know why they think it is such a goal, but as I said some think that by beating them they are going to "shut them up" But to me it is no different than winning any other game, you beat a good team or a bad team you move on and you get ready for the next team

Well I was just trying to clear some air. It seem that everywhere you go or what ever you do as a person of color... you are looked down on and ridicule...We(people of color)should be the ones praised for building this country into what it is today.I just wanted STL17 to know that my comment early wasn't in a Racist manner. I was only comparing the two circuits. The treatment from the white circuit organizators just treat you inferior and thats one reason I refuse to participate in there events. thats my option! ....stl i will be playing at the fairgrounds next year! Peace and Harmony!!!!!1

Well said #15! As a black player that have played at all levels of the "White circuit" from D to A-AA Major. That softball experience is much different for most of us as black players. What I mean by different, relates more to some of our cultural differences and how we may socialize together.

For those of you that have played on both circuits understand that your motivations are different for playing on the "White circuit" versus the "Black circuit"

Having played this game for twenty years now and could ramble on and on, but I shall not do so. In closing just let me say that a tournament is a tournament. If your desire is a memorable experience both on and off the field. "Aint" no experience like the "Black Softball" experience!!!!

Much love and kudos to Nell, Hercle, Carmen and the BASA family. Keep doing the "**** thang" with BASA softball.

In the words of my man T-Mac, "Winners Compete" no matter what circuit you play on. Enjoy your off season and good luck in 06.


Ron Johnson

I didn't at all mean that you or anyone else was a racist. I have played in many BASA tournaments, and you are right, I have never been treated unfairly. But I have also seen many BASA teams play in USSSA, NSA, etc tournaments, and be treated no different than any of the other teams.

The comments from the other post just struck a nerve the other day, and my real question to everyone is "why can't we all just co-exist, and get along. I play for the love of the game, the friendships made, and my competitive spirit. To me it's not a white tournament, or a black tournament, it's a Softball tournament, and I just wish all of us could get past the other issues.

Your comments made regarding what people did in the 1800's, regarding slavery, and Christianity don't hold any water today. I'm not or never was a slave or slave owner, and neither were you. That is part of what is wrong with our society today is that we still hold a grudge for things that occurred decades ago. I cannot change history and the way people behaved back then, if I could I'd do it in minute.

The way I look at it fella's is I am a whiteboy and I don't give a F what your race is. If you are a A-hole then you are just a A-hole. You guys are talking about this SLAVERY thing, ain't one white boy or black dude lived through it that we see on the field, move on. Good people,fair people get treated like what they are. I love everybody until I get the reason not to. White team, black team,mixed team, asian team,cambodian team, I just want to win. Show everyone love that deserves it.

My point exactly!

Stl17 and RW, u are in the minority my friends!!! The fact is, the "white circuit" is different for whatever reason. I played a little BASA last year, but it is all I am going to play for the most part the rest of my softball career. I played all ASA, U-trip, NSA and it is a mess w/ SOME teams. I don't wanna or have to deal w/ racism in SOFTBALL, it is supposed to be fun, but IT DOES STILL HAPPEN TODAY! White teams talk crap and to be quite honest don't want u there. Heck we played a tournament in Iowa, won it and practically had to beat the whole city. Umps, concession people all of them were cheating and hated to see us win that money. Some things just can't be stopped though. SO, with that said just know everyone doesn't think like u two.

nobody said in the minority me friend, comment off of what I did say please. A topic like this can get stretched way to easily.

I am going to have to disagree here. It isn't just softball. Racism still exists today, maybe not neccessarily on the softball.

So please don't think that these trucks I see at alot of the tournaments here in the South with the Rebel flags on them, leave their racism in the truck when they get out.

And please don't think that as black softball players we can just forget what we have been through during the week when we step foot on the field. You are going to have your antennas up.

And I see on the "other" boards that they don't agree with the 3 non-black rule. The only difference is they don't put it in writing. Look at your top sponsored teams, none of them have have more than 3 blacks on them. And when we win a tournament they go all out to call us thugs and every other name they can.

Sorry,
Had to chime in.

That's bull**** first off, you act like on the BASA circuit your welcomed with open arms. I'm the most non-judmental kat you know, I had to show people I was worth a chit for them to call me by my name. Until that point I was known as WHITEBOY or Honky. Not real nice huh. I didn't cry about it. It just made me want to perform more. Stay focused,play the game and things will sort themselves out.

It exists in everybody,not every person. BLack folks racist to. Let's not try to one up.I can't speak for everyone. That is why I said in my first post, Treat people how they impression you.

If you play on a team that let's your opponents call you those names, you play with some busters. I play on both circuits as well and if I was called a racist name, first off, I am putting my foot in that person's behind and every teammate of mine that does not help me.

You have other issues.

Guys ....white guys...exactly...you are going to feel like everything is okay today because you are not face with the issues we are faced with.......further more maybe you wasn't a slave owner or an overseer but your forefathers compensated from the blood,sweat and tears of Blacks....here in America..... And I see the ignorance already just by reading what you reply was...maybe I wasn't back then but just 40 years ago Blacks was still 2/3 a man. Just 40 years ago fellas....I wasn't there but my grand mom got spit on, beat ,and raped by men of your race. Hell I did not do anything to the JEWS but guess what We(Americans) compensate them for the Holocaust......Hell we saved their lives. Basically I'm saying is that because you don't see the racisim doesn't mean it's not there. do you know how many Black men and women who has been accused of crimes white men have committed? man I can talk about this all day but I'm still not RACIST! I just wish one day that we all can just be on the same accord.....Did you know that we just renewed the voting rights for Blacks.....for another 40 or so years. RENEWED! WOW! IS THAT BAD OR WHAT!!!!!1 Let's Play Ball!

I hear you pimpin, can't change the world. If only racism was our only problem today. I don't hate anyone, I just don't respect some folks. White and blacks. Just for the record, sorry about the old days. I face the same problems as you guys. Today the only color that matters is green. GET MONEY!

Agreed.....And with regard to #15's remark about "Renewing Blacks Voting Rights", that's just not true. What was just renewed was the "Voting rights act of 1965", which has no impact on anyones right to vote.

This is a direct quote from the NAACP "African American voting rights were granted by the Fifteenth Amendment, which was passed immediately after the Civil War. Expiration of the Voting Rights Act will not terminate the rights granted under the Fifteenth Amendment".

To further prove your inaccuracies this is a quote from the U.S. Department of Justice - "The basic prohibition against discrimination in voting contained in the Fifteenth amendment and in the Voting Rights Act does not expire in 2007 — it does not expire at all; it is permanent".

This is the type of rhetoric that causes separation between us, it's built upon false impressions.

This really needs to stop. You can go on all day with this type of stuff. Bottom line racism will always exist whether it be white and black or us against our own race. You have to grow from your experiences in life. We can't always say what happened to us back in the day when someone of the opposite race offends you. Do we as a people even stand up for our cause when it really counts?, so why have all of this over black and white circuits in softball. Life is not always fair.

Yeah, you're right, but this is what does expire.

***************
the authorization of the U.S. Attorney General to send federal registrars (examiners) to register voters, in counties where the local registrar refuses to register blacks. [Section 6, 42 U.S.C. § 1973d]


the authorization of the U.S. Attorney General to send federal observers to monitor elections, to make sure that blacks who are eligible to vote are actually permitted to vote, and that their votes are actually counted. [Section 8, 42 U.S.C. § 1973f]


the requirement that specially covered jurisdictions gain the approval of the U.S. Attorney General before implementing new voting practices or procedures, to make sure that any voting changes that they make are not racially discriminatory. [Section 5, 42 U.S.C. § 1973c]
************

And if racism does not exist, then why can't this law be made permanent.

The 2000 elections proved this segment is still very valuable. Once it is of of the books, it will never be put back on.

Fan you are correct......We will solve nothing on here. It's as though certain individuals will always find a reason to dislike, or distrust other individuals. This is not something that Congress, or laws will fix, it's something that each individual needs to fix within themselves.

STL17

You are right, we will settle nothing on here, but at least we can have dialogue without yelling racial epitaths at each other. I love seeing non-black players on the circuit, because you guys and gals help dispel the rumors on the other circuits. I have nothing but love for you.

But again, you need to find another team if your teammates let folk talk to you like that.

stl17 we can discuss racism forever but the point is dont come on the basa website telling blacks what they should or should not say because it offends you as a caucasian. i dont know about every one else but i can care less whether you were offended or not. you dont have to log on. we are going to continue to use common black phrases and terminology. this is our forum which you should consider it a previlage to be a part of. i think tthe discussion got off track somewhere. point is dont come on here telling us what we should or should not say period. end of discussion.
Church can i get a hit. pass it on

1st Timer.......Let me start by saying that I never said I was offended. I simply asked a question related to a previous post. I also never questioned any of your so called "Black Phrases and Terminology".

In fact, let me show you my exact post that started this mess.

**Why is it that you must call out the white teams? Are white teams really that bad to play against? I happen to be white, and I have never had a problem playing in any black tournament. You have to comfortable around yourself or you'll never be comfortable around anyone else black/white/red, doesn't matter.**

And as far as me telling you what you can and can't say on this board....It didn't happen, simply asked a question.

How that was ever misconstrued to be that I was dogging anyone I don't know. It shouldn't matter about color. I know there are those who will make an issue of it, but it shouldn't matter. That was my only point.

I have much love for all people, and it's only when someone does something to hurt me or my family that I would feel any other way.

First timer for having strong feelings toward this subject. I have the same strong feelings toward the fact that we are all brothers and sisters, and children of God, so we all have a common bond.

a-men, we are all brothers and sisters on this earth and we had better learn to live together before we destroy each other. One more thing, please grow the hell up. Judge people by their actions and get out out of the slavery mentality of this black verses white crap. There are good blacks and their are bad blacks. There are good whites and bad whites. Give every man/woman the benifit of the doubt until they do something to you. Then you judge. Learn to live together and play ball together. It is a beautiful thing. Can't we all just get along. lol.

Tha circuits are different we know,& i know stl17 & robbie.They are some cool cats & i grew up with #17 & he's a stand up person & my derrty robbie has a sista fo his queen so it's all good. Lets play some ball & throw all this garbage in tha trash can! peace.

STL17, I'mma school you before it is over; I'm glad I got you looking at the right of "Black folks" because we need more people like you in the world to fight for the rights of all people. Thanks for the Debate or dialogue...what ever you want to call it....
But if you look below these are the changes that can be made. what do you think changing the candidacy requirements are talking about....can't be talking about the requirements of whites because ya'll don't have an admendment to give ya'll the right to vote.....it's just known!!!!!1 My thing is before 1965 my mom wasn't even allowed to vote...so do see how close to home this is to use as Black men and women in America. My mom could not vote on future,education,welfare,....basically my life..so now we stay aware!!!!!1

The Supreme Court has determined that "changes affecting voting" that are subject to review generally fall into four categories: (1) changes in the manner of voting; (2) changes in candidacy requirements and qualifications; (3) changes in the composition of the electorate that may vote for candidates for a given office; and (4) changes affecting the creation or abolition of an elective office. Presley v. Etowah, 502 U.S. 491 (1992).

In 1970, Congress recognized the continuing need for the special provisions of the Act, which were due to expire that year, and renewed them for another five years. It added a second prong to the coverage formula, identical to the original formula except that it referenced November 1968 as the relevant date for the maintenance of a test or device and the levels of voter registration and electoral participation

In 1975, the Act's special provisions were extended for another seven years, and were broadened to address voting discrimination against members of "language minority groups," which were defined as persons who are American Indian, Asian American, Alaskan Natives or of Spanish heritage." As before, Congress expanded the coverage formula, based on the presence of tests or devices and levels of voter registration and participation as of November 1972

In 1982, the coverage formula was extended again, this time for 25 years, but no changes were made to it. Section 4, along with those other sections that are dependent upon it, such as Section 5, 6, and 8, will expire on August 6, 2007.


See STL17 today in society Racism isn't really out in your face it is hidden but I want you to look how the government can manipulate words so ordinary people won't be able to understand. If you are revisiting the Voting Rights Act of 1965; that mean it can be changed at anytimes. I listed the parts that can be changed.
I wasn't saying thatYou was a racist or anyone else, I was simply saying that us as Americans need to be aware because the main fight now are between the rich and the middle-class. I love to play ball and I respect every man as that a man.....until I'm disrepected....I don't care if you are green, white,black,orange or what. I'm glad that this dialogue didn't get out of hand because I don't want to cause any fraction with anyone...unless revoked to do so! I apologize to anyone that think I offended them... I really didn't try to do that!
Everyone have a great weekend!!!!!1

stl17 you were offended if not you would not have asked the question. i have 2 white faces at my dinner every thanks giving and Christmas. they are my sister in laws. cant afford to be a racist it takes up too much energy and my holidays would be miserable. however some discussions they dont take part in because they understand that eventhough they are a part of us they are not one of us. there is a difference. what i am saying to you no your place. so dont come opening up this can because its not your place to do so. the more you try to defend yourself the more i question who you really are. #15 you dont owe him and apology he should be doing the apologizing.

You are way off base my friend......And to be honest, it is you that maybe we should be questioning "who you really are". I merely asked the question, and you took it down the racist path. I am not a racist, have never done anything that would even allow one to consider me to be. The fact that you are so defensive regarding a simple question leads me to believe that maybe you are the one with race issues.

AS MANY REPLIERS OF THIS TOPIC HAS SAID. GIVE IT A REST. POINT MADE. WE IN THIS AGE AND TIME SHOULD JUST LIVE AND LOVE AND JUST FOCUS ON WEEDING OUT THE BAD AND NEGATIVE THOUGHTS, FOCUS ON POSITIVE AND GOOD WILL.


ALL THE LOVE IN THE WORLD FOR ALL. GO WITH IT.

yes it was a simple question but my point is simple also. you were out of line and out of place to come on a black softball website and initiate this discussion because you were offended. no your place.there were other white guys that had their views and that is fine but they did not initiate discussion , you did and you were wrong.

spellc check.....know

I would like to recoginized the Aniversary of the Montgomery Bus Boycott! It's been 50 years! I thought the discussion would lead into convesation about this great day in history ....not to belittle anyone but to increase awareness....unfortuately no one from Alabama responded...Dinsum(where you at) I just love being a MAN of Color...I represent strenght, honor, intergity and PRIDE!!!!!1

T. Canty

Check your email.

Wolf....Thanks for the kind words. If I stirred up a hornets nest here that wasn't the plan. Maybe I should not have said anything, but I didn't think it was like that on here.

I'll definately be more careful with what I speak about on here. You have to admit though, it brought out some good conversation. And I commend each person that stands up for their beliefs!

Peace.

no love lost stl17 . Take care and see you around

Well derrty , this web site is tha s##T compared to (ALL) other softball web sites.We support our own as you can see but at tha same time 90% of tha convo is real entertainment & tha 10% of it is what you make it.I have 2 teams that's asking about you so holla at me asap & we'll go from there! 314-369-5583 or 314-914-8978 peace derrty!

STL17 no love lost playa just conversing with you my BROTHA. Be Safe and have a Beautiful Christams and New year. Holla when you see me. I'll be at the Nelly tourney.#15 south Ga. Magic!!!!!1

RW, I meant you have an open mind and see people for who they are not what color they are. I wish all people were like that! Unfortunately some of us cannot be!

#15 and 1st Timer........Peace to both of you! I think we brought to light some good points through all of this. We may disagree in some areas, but I think we also agree in many as well.

Hope to see you on the field in 06, and make sure you holla at me as well.

Tommy Henry - Wanted everyone to know I too am a real person, not hiding behind a screen name.

Peace

where is this coming from and why was it brought up.

Todd you haft to have been there! you are a day late and a dollar short!